semele

I'm having an "Oh fuck, do I really ship this???" moment XD.

Also: I caught a flu or something, so I'm stuck at home and I can finally do my re-watch properly! And I've just finished 2x10, where an interesting thing happens. When Damon catches Elena in Richmond and tries to bully her into going back to Mystic Falls, there is some weirdly sexualized body language going on, and when I was watching it for the first time, I sort of waved it off as gratuitious. Well, it's not. Damon is consciously using sexual innuendos to make Elena feel uneasy, to put her off-guard and make it easier for himself to make her do whatever he wants. I'm going to pay attention to this scheme, because it looks very similar to the "Buffy training session" in s3: Damon consciously tries to make Elena feel uncomfortable. I wonder how often he does it in s2. This was the only way he could manipulate her, and he lost it in 3x08, when Elena was comfortabe enough around him that the bed scene could happen. Up to 3x08 manipulation could go both ways, but now it seems that Damon's lost his leverage. Damon is generally off-guard, don't you think? The way he acted out in Disturbing Behavior? He's done things like that before, but he was always very careful for Elena not to see. In s3 Damon is getting sloppy (because he worries about Stefan so much he has too much on his plate? Because he got used to work with his brother as a team, and now that he's alone again he starts making mistakes?) and he lets Elena see things he'd never let her see before (feeding on Caroline's dad, angry outburst in 3x09). Looks like someone is giving up A LOT OF POWER over here.

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I'm having an "Oh fuck, do I really ship this???" moment XD.

HAHAHA that is LITERALLY what I was thinking while typing all that. Like, self, what is even up with your brain that you enjoy this shit. #no amount of therapy will fix my issues

Sorry about your flu! But YAY for re-watch thoughts! GREAT point about Damon's behaviour in 2x10. I actually caught this on first viewing, but like you I waved it off as gratuitous. Interestingly, I saw A LOT of blah blah over the ~sexual tension~ in the D/E scenes in that episode (which was inappropriate considering Damon's behaviour), and I waved that off too as "shippers gonna ship", but--what you're saying makes complete sense. I can absolutely buy that the weird sexual vibe in those scenes is deliberate. There's really no need for Damon to move in so close to Elena and stare at her mouth and whatnot. He's absolutely using his sexuality as a form of intimidation.

I think that's the only significant instance in S2, but there are A LOT of examples in S3. The nudity scene in 3x01, the scene in 3x03 where he suggests she was having wet dreams (lol) about him, the kitchen scene in 3x04 about the necklace, and the obvious ~"this is the way to a vampire's heart"~ moment in direct response to Elena asking him to do it for~ her. It's a bizarre manifestation of insecurity. Fairly desperate way to hold on to a semblance of power, really. But you're right--that's done with after 3x08. Because Elena gave in, she let him stay and turned off the light and then fell asleep beside him, which displayed a lot of trust without strings. And then she made it clear that HE can trust HER in 3x09. So... Now I don't know where they'll go from here. Will they continue to play games? I sadistically hope so, because 1) I ENJOY TRAINWRECKS OKAY; 2) there is too much that is fucked up in their relationship for the writers not to explore. They are playing with fire. I will be mad if we don't get to see the full force of that explosion. :)

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Like, self, what is even up with your brain that you enjoy this shit.

I like your brain. #what is therapy?

I got to the part of s2 I don't know by heart, and I'm super-excited. I liked it very much when I was watching it for the first time, but now that I know a part of s3, s2 is even better!

He's absolutely using his sexuality as a form of intimidation.

And he did the same with Isobel in s1! Made out with her before he started threatening her! Damon Salvatore, I adore your playing with gender roles. You know you're sexy, and you're using it.

It's a bizarre manifestation of insecurity. Fairly desperate way to hold on to a semblance of power, really.

Well, he has a bit of power here, because Elena is uncomfortable with her own sexuality. Or rather she used to be, because I believe that the bed scene was a game changer, and from now on when Damon tries to provoke Elena, she'll provoke him back just to show him that he's lost his leverage.

Now I'm wondering how much Damon is really comfortable with his sexuality. Is it real, or is it just an act? He might've been born like that, some people just have no shame, and there is nothing in flashbacks (at least nothing I remember) that would indicate one thing or another. But if it's a part of his performance and a manipulative technique he's learned (in our culture it's relatively easy to intimidate women with this kind of behavior, and it's even easier to intimidate men if you're a man yourself. So Damon usually doesn't need to go far with his provocation, a little is enough to make his opponent feel uneasy), then it leaves an interesting opening here if Elena does as I want her to do and starts using his own weapon against him. It might turn out that Damon is not that comfortable with his own sexuality after all.

Actually it's not that impossible, you know? When Katherine flashes him in s2 (the shower scene after she got out of the tomb), he has this FML facial expression and he is a bit nervous. It might be that he's just surprised that she broke free, but if it's not?

God, I'm reading too much into a teen vampire show again...

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And he did the same with Isobel in s1! Made out with her before he started threatening her! Damon Salvatore, I adore your playing with gender roles. You know you're sexy, and you're using it.

LMFAO. Now I'm reminded of that "I'm sexy and I know it" song. Anyway. YES. Indeed. Damon wields his sexual appeal like a weapon. Just like Katherine does. It's fascinating to me that this is the primary way by which he defines himself--by how desirable he is to others. It's not the same as Katherine undermining the system by bending its rules (i.e. taking advantage of the fact that women are expected to be desirable for men in order to manipulate men); Damon shouldn't need to objectify himself to such a degree, and yet he does... And now I'm thinking of that hilarious moment where Elena and Alaric essentially whore Damon out to Rebekah, not even asking his opinion on the matter. XD

I agree that Elena's not so comfortable with the less heteronormative parts of her sexuality (she's only a teenager still), but one thing I appreciated about Elena/Stefan was how sexually assertive she was with him. That's obviously in contrast to her not-relationship with Damon. Scenes like their last one in 3x02 and their "training" in 3x08 are interesting to me in that she seems to be waiting for HIM to make a ~move. So fucked. PLAYING WITH FIRE, CHILDREN.

I can't believe Damon is that secure in his sexuality. He flaunts himself ALL. THE. TIME. That's overcompensating. It's gender performance. He's absorbed the idea that he's good mostly to LOOK GOOD, and he uses that to get by. And I'm glad that you mentioned that he uses it against men too, because HE TOTALLY DOES, lol. Like in mid-S2 when he's threatening John at one point, and he leans in~ and whispers in John's ear. I laughed out loud.

ITA about that shower scene. You're not the only one who picked up on that FML expression. XD I SO WANT ELENA TO PWN DAMON IN SUCH A WAY. I mean. Not just for the hot, but for the character development~ lmao. I AIN'T EVEN MAD.

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Btw, you know I'm practically using this discussion as a notepad for the meta? XD

I can't believe Damon is that secure in his sexuality.

Neither can I, mostly because Damon + 100% secure = DOES NOT COMPUTE. As you said, it's a performance and it only goes skin-deep. It's based on an assumption that in the heteronormative world, sexual provocation form a man makes people back off. He never tries this trick with Katherine (he does provoke her sexually, but only to lure her out and give himself an opening to reject her again; he doesn't try to intimidate her, because he knows it wouldn't work), and if a woman he's provoking actually started playing along, he would be completely lost. ~~And then he would beg her to have sex with him, because if a girl can intimidate him like this, he is sure to be head over heels for her.~~

Now I kind of want a fic in which Elena tries to intimidate Damon with her sexualized behavior, and he is caught off-guard. I want him to be shy and in awe. Damon, my boy, you know you would.

And now I'm thinking of that hilarious moment where Elena and Alaric essentially whore Damon out to Rebekah, not even asking his opinion on the matter. XD

He wouldn't object anyway XD. He has an act to keep up, so he can't refuse to be whored out. It would ruin the entire "Damon is a sexual predator" image.

You're right with Elena being sexually assertive with Stefan, but waiting for Damon to make a move. It makes sense, I guess: Stefan is her boyfriend and she loves him, but she doesn't feel comfortable enough to even tell Caroline that she is attracted to Damon. She is ok with the fact that she has sexual needs, but being attracted to Damon still feels wrong. I guess we talked about it already? It's ok for Elena to be assertive with Stefan, but not with Damon, because she feels it's not ok for her to just want to fuck him senseless, no cozy feelings attached?

It's fascinating to me that this is the primary way by which he defines himself--by how desirable he is to others.

Well, Stefan might be about a struggle for self control, but Damon is all about power play. Which might be one of the reasons I like him so much.

And I'm glad that you mentioned that he uses it against men too, because HE TOTALLY DOES, lol.

He also tries it with Alaric, only it doesn't work at all XD. Hey, now that I think about it, Alaric must feel pretty secure in his own body. He just gracefully ignores Damon's innuendos.

Not just for the hot, but for the character development~ lmao.

OF COURSE IT'S FOR CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT!!!

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I AM SO PUMPED FOR YOUR FUCKING META. It is the meaning of my life for the next two weeks. :D

and if a woman he's provoking actually started playing along, he would be completely lost. And then he would beg her to have sex with him, because if a girl can intimidate him like this, he is sure to be head over heels for her.

TRUTH.

Now I kind of want a fic in which Elena tries to intimidate Damon with her sexualized behavior, and he is caught off-guard. I want him to be shy and in awe. Damon, my boy, you know you would.

I giggled uncontrollably at this sentence. Not even gonna front.

It's ok for Elena to be assertive with Stefan, but not with Damon, because she feels it's not ok for her to just want to fuck him senseless, no cozy feelings attached?

Yes, indeed. Though it might work the other way around too. Elena does strike me as a romantic-romantic. I think that the stronger her feelings (in general) for Damon grow, the more physically attracted she is to him. Nina plays it that way too. Compare their early S1 scenes to their veritable smorgasbord of UST moments this season. I think Elena is so hesitant to admit an attraction because even a purely physical attraction might open the floodgates to a tidal wave of ~other feelings.

Well, Stefan might be about a struggle for self control, but Damon is all about power play. Which might be one of the reasons I like him so much.

Huh. Elaborate?

Hey, now that I think about it, Alaric must feel pretty secure in his own body. He just gracefully ignores Damon's innuendos.

BAHAHA. And this is what leads to scenes like in 3x02 when he opens the door to "Damon" while shirtless and unzipped. :D

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I AM SO PUMPED FOR YOUR FUCKING META. It is the meaning of my life for the next two weeks. :D

Now I'm intimidated :P.

Good point about Elena, sex and feelings! It makes sense, especially since, well, she wasn't attracted to Damon in early s1, and now he didn't get any sexier, physically (the 3x01 shirt being a glorious exception, DAMON, SON, YOU SHOULD HAVE AN ENTIRE WARDROBE OF THOSE SHIRTS AND NEVER TAKE THEM OFF!!!). Oh God, she is literally falling in love with his glorious personality. Oh God.

Stefan is constantly struggling with himself: it's all about HIS bloodlust, HIS self-control, HIS ability to keep it together. Damon, on the other hand, is constantly relating to others. He keeps challenging people, he gets into power plays (like, he tries how far he can go before someone kicks his ass), he provokes. He is submissive, but he never lets it happen without a fight. He enjoys it when people have power over him, but at the same time he doesn't give this power just to anybody. He picks the strongest, either physically or emotionally, and it looks like he also enjoys testing their strenght. It's not like with Spike, who simply liked competition; it's more complicated. Like with Elena: he tries to make her believe she has no power over him, she's not buying it and she keeps pushing, and that's what gets him all intrigued!

Look at the scene from 3x05. Elena just makes a face and asks him why he left her, and he instanty offers a promise that he'll never do that again. He doesn't do it because he's so whipped. He does it because Elena has earned this level of submission by constanty demanding it for months, and not taking "no" for an answer. People need to earn their power over Damon, and he likes giving it away gradually.

Am I making any sense? Because I kind of feel that I'm babbling...

And this is what leads to scenes like in 3x02 when he opens the door to "Damon" while shirtless and unzipped. :D

I'm a Damon/Alaric shipper, ok? And the INHUMAN sound I made when I saw this scene... Well, you could probably hear it in Australia.

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NOOOOO DON'T BE INTIMIDATED IT WILL BE GLORIOUS \o/

the 3x01 shirt being a glorious exception, DAMON, SON, YOU SHOULD HAVE AN ENTIRE WARDROBE OF THOSE SHIRTS AND NEVER TAKE THEM OFF!!!

LOL! I laughed at that shirt, honestly. I mean. IT'S HOT. But it's so... purple. LOL. I'm always ??? whenever Damon wears bright colours. Though, that is an interesting topic of debate: HOW SEXY ON A SCALE OF [X] IS DAMON PER SEASON?? ::strokes chin::

Oh God, she is literally falling in love with his glorious personality. Oh God.

LORD SAVE US.

YESSSSS, you make all of the sense re: Damon and power plays. You are so so right about him not giving his power/trust away until it's ~earned. He's looking for his match. He needs to be challenged. (In that sense, I totally relate with him; I would NEVER be able to have a relationship with a yes-person. Damon is easily bored, and so am I.) I think it's more than that though. I think Damon has this need to push and push the people around him to test their loyalty. Why is it real with Stefan and Elena and Alaric? Because he's done EVERYTHING IN HIS POWER to push them away, via a series of incredibly self-destructive/destructive choices, and they're still here anyway. IT'S REAL. He wants it to be real.

Haha, I ship Alaric and Damon too, and was thus \o/ \o/ \o/ at that 3x02 scene. (Though, admittedly I don't ship them as hard as I do other Damon ships.)

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This shirt was purple? On my screen it looked black... And now I need to watch it again to check! *purely scientific purpose*

Though, that is an interesting topic of debate: HOW SEXY ON A SCALE OF [X] IS DAMON PER SEASON??

You should totally make a serious post with pictures, and then we can debate!

Yeah, I've had a relationship with a yes-person once, I'm definitely NOT doing it ever again, so when I was writing that comment, I was all: "Hmm, is it still Damon, or am I projecting?" ;).

Point with testing loyalty! But, at the same time, he kind of expects them to accept everything and love him anyway (look how surprised he is when it turnes out that yes, Alaric DOES mind being killed on a whim). He's so convinced they'll all get over everything eventually, and I can't quite grasp when did that happen.

Damon/Alaric is one of my more important ships, but right now I'm so deeply into "OMG D/E" haze it's hard to get my mind onto Damon/Katherine, let alone ships that have completely nothing to do with Elena...

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This whole conversation is A++++.

Damon and his relative levels of sexiness should ABSOLUTELY be a post of its own. Season 1 Damon is clearly a thing of beauty, but I think for the most part it should be judged on an episode by episode basis. Like, there were some really unfortunate hair episodes in season 2, but also some ridiculously sexy Damon episodes. I NEED GIFS PLEASE.

Yeah, so far my contribution to the discussion has not exactly been academic...#priorities, they are straight

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Are you kidding? It's already been proven that Damon's levels of sexiness are CRUCIAL to the plot, hence your contribution is TOTALLY ACADEMIC.

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TRUTH. My need for shirtless gifs is all about examining the degree to which Damon has exploited his own sexuality for Machiavellian purposes throughout the TVD timeline. Of course.

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WIIIIIIIIIIIIIIN. I'm totally NOT here, because I'm writing a paper, but, girl, you just made my day.

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S1!Damon

S2!Damon

S3!Damon

(^eye-porn)

SO? WHAT IS THE VERDICT? HM?

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I'm not sure about Damon, but YOU are my favorite person today!

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HAPPY TO SATISFY~~~~

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I'm having one of those moments when I simply cannot believe something that beautiful exists. Making it hard to focus on the question. What question? Oh, right.

The verdict is that ALL DAMONS ARE EXCELLENT DAMONS.

~~Seriously, I can't stop staring at the eye-porn. MAKE ME STOP.~~

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AND ON THE SEVENTH DAY, GOD CREATED IAN SOMERHALDER~~~

The verdict is that ALL DAMONS ARE EXCELLENT DAMONS.

lol. Why is this sentence so amusing to me.

I WILL NEVER STOP YOU. YOU MUST SUFFER THIS EXQUISITE TORTURE TOO.

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AND ON THE SEVENTH DAY, GOD CREATED IAN SOMERHALDER

Such a better use of his time than resting. #blasphemy #worthit

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