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semeleThis post contains A Song of Ice and Fire books spoilers.
Comment to this post, and I will list five things I associate with you. They might make sense or they might be totally random. Then post that list, with your commentary, to your LJ (or just add a reply back to me). Other people (including me) can get lists from you, and the meme merrily perpetuates itself.
So,![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
ever_neutral gave me:
01. non-functional Damon/Elena
I AM GOING TO BE BRIEF ABOUT IT. Mostly because I'm in the middle of writing a D/E meta. Besides, a brief look at my journal should be enough for you to tell that lately I've became this crazy shipper person.
This ship is my current obsession, mostly because it just begs for future!fics in which both Damon and Elena are gloriously fucked up. So I love Damon/Elena as a ship that is based on very casual, mundane disappointments, on disillusionment and on a weird yet real friendship. I indulge in Damon's inclinations towards drama and in Elena's worst tendencies. Those two can be truly romantic, and they can do it in the most creepy way.
02. Wesley Wyndam-Pryce!
I need Wesley like I need oxygen ;). What I love about him the most is the LOGIC with which he was written: he is this character who seems to have changed every aspect of himself, but in fact he didn't. Even the dark, broken Wesley who helps Illyria still has some traces of the old, silly, know-it-all Wesley. He can make the hardest choices without blinking, and it doesn't matter if it is handing Faith to the Council, stealing Connor or destroying Vail's memory spell. Wesley always makes the hard choice. He doesn't hesitate, he doesn't wait for someone to decide for him, he just does it, and then he bears the consequences.
Wesley is tragic, but he is also a bit pathetic, he would make a fool of himself or help Illyria just because she looks like Fred. He speaks dozens of languages, and yet he still can't express himself. He had his throat cut, and his friends abandoned him, and then he had this memory taken away from him. He fell in love with Fred, because she was this sweet, innocent person he would've loved before he was broken, than he discovered some dark things about her and he fell in love with who she really was, then it was taken away form him, and Wesley fell in love with the Ideal Fred again. He lost her before he rediscovered the truth, and now (I live in the AU world in which Wesley is alive, and I have to think very hard to remember that it is actuallyle_mru's fic, not canon) he is left with the blue King-God who doesn't know a thing about humans. And Wesley makes himself a tool, he uses his most private experiences in order to teach Illyria about the world.
He was Faith's worst Watcher. He was her best Watcher. He will never forgive her, but it's ok, because she should never forgive him either. Faith was the one who started making Wesley who he is right now. Lilah really knew him, and it was the worst thing about her. Wesley has wretched luck when it comes to women. Wesley has the best luck when it comes to women. Wesley is the smartest guy I've ever seen. Wesley doesn't know how the fuck could he function now.
Besides... All the books, swords, smart speeches, variety of shirts, ultimate pain - WESLEY, HOW SO HOT??? I seem to recall a post in which we were already considering this problem.
03. Jon/Robb
YOU KNOW NOTHING, JON SNOW! Ok, that's painfully off-topic, but I had to ;).
I actually don't ship it very hard. But I blamemlekopijca for the fact that I ship it at all (well, most of my slash pairings started from the fact that she was nagging me...). Jon wanted to run away from the Wall just to be with his brother. Robb stood up to his mother to make his brother his heir. Jon should be the king, and Robb should be his Warden of the North. Martin did it wrong, and someone should fix this mistake RIGH NOW!
04. fic-writing
I'm a compulsive fic writer. I've been doing it for over six years now (how did it happen? o_O), and it grew to be a form of self-expression for me. It's more than just fun, I actually get all "artistic" about writing, feelings exposed and so on. Well, ok, not always. Sometimes. And sometimes it's just fun. But I can't imagine myself not writing. I can have breaks, sometimes long breaks, but I come back eventually. I get enthusiastic about writing. I get emotional about writing. I get geeky about writing. I want to try new things and be challenged. I talk about writing. As I've said - compulsive writer :).
05. teaching
Yes, I do it ;). I've been giving private lessons for over five years now. I mostly teach English, occasionally History (that's because far more people want to learn English). I mostly teach young children, like, 10-12 years old, but my History students all were in their final year of high school :). I have many funny/scary stories starting with "Yesterday my student told me...", but I'm not telling any of them in an unlocked post ;).
Comment to this post, and I will list five things I associate with you. They might make sense or they might be totally random. Then post that list, with your commentary, to your LJ (or just add a reply back to me). Other people (including me) can get lists from you, and the meme merrily perpetuates itself.
So,
ever_neutral gave me:01. non-functional Damon/Elena
I AM GOING TO BE BRIEF ABOUT IT. Mostly because I'm in the middle of writing a D/E meta. Besides, a brief look at my journal should be enough for you to tell that lately I've became this crazy shipper person.
This ship is my current obsession, mostly because it just begs for future!fics in which both Damon and Elena are gloriously fucked up. So I love Damon/Elena as a ship that is based on very casual, mundane disappointments, on disillusionment and on a weird yet real friendship. I indulge in Damon's inclinations towards drama and in Elena's worst tendencies. Those two can be truly romantic, and they can do it in the most creepy way.
02. Wesley Wyndam-Pryce!
I need Wesley like I need oxygen ;). What I love about him the most is the LOGIC with which he was written: he is this character who seems to have changed every aspect of himself, but in fact he didn't. Even the dark, broken Wesley who helps Illyria still has some traces of the old, silly, know-it-all Wesley. He can make the hardest choices without blinking, and it doesn't matter if it is handing Faith to the Council, stealing Connor or destroying Vail's memory spell. Wesley always makes the hard choice. He doesn't hesitate, he doesn't wait for someone to decide for him, he just does it, and then he bears the consequences.
Wesley is tragic, but he is also a bit pathetic, he would make a fool of himself or help Illyria just because she looks like Fred. He speaks dozens of languages, and yet he still can't express himself. He had his throat cut, and his friends abandoned him, and then he had this memory taken away from him. He fell in love with Fred, because she was this sweet, innocent person he would've loved before he was broken, than he discovered some dark things about her and he fell in love with who she really was, then it was taken away form him, and Wesley fell in love with the Ideal Fred again. He lost her before he rediscovered the truth, and now (I live in the AU world in which Wesley is alive, and I have to think very hard to remember that it is actually
le_mru's fic, not canon) he is left with the blue King-God who doesn't know a thing about humans. And Wesley makes himself a tool, he uses his most private experiences in order to teach Illyria about the world.He was Faith's worst Watcher. He was her best Watcher. He will never forgive her, but it's ok, because she should never forgive him either. Faith was the one who started making Wesley who he is right now. Lilah really knew him, and it was the worst thing about her. Wesley has wretched luck when it comes to women. Wesley has the best luck when it comes to women. Wesley is the smartest guy I've ever seen. Wesley doesn't know how the fuck could he function now.
Besides... All the books, swords, smart speeches, variety of shirts, ultimate pain - WESLEY, HOW SO HOT??? I seem to recall a post in which we were already considering this problem.
03. Jon/Robb
YOU KNOW NOTHING, JON SNOW! Ok, that's painfully off-topic, but I had to ;).
I actually don't ship it very hard. But I blame
mlekopijca for the fact that I ship it at all (well, most of my slash pairings started from the fact that she was nagging me...). Jon wanted to run away from the Wall just to be with his brother. Robb stood up to his mother to make his brother his heir. Jon should be the king, and Robb should be his Warden of the North. Martin did it wrong, and someone should fix this mistake RIGH NOW!04. fic-writing
I'm a compulsive fic writer. I've been doing it for over six years now (how did it happen? o_O), and it grew to be a form of self-expression for me. It's more than just fun, I actually get all "artistic" about writing, feelings exposed and so on. Well, ok, not always. Sometimes. And sometimes it's just fun. But I can't imagine myself not writing. I can have breaks, sometimes long breaks, but I come back eventually. I get enthusiastic about writing. I get emotional about writing. I get geeky about writing. I want to try new things and be challenged. I talk about writing. As I've said - compulsive writer :).
05. teaching
Yes, I do it ;). I've been giving private lessons for over five years now. I mostly teach English, occasionally History (that's because far more people want to learn English). I mostly teach young children, like, 10-12 years old, but my History students all were in their final year of high school :). I have many funny/scary stories starting with "Yesterday my student told me...", but I'm not telling any of them in an unlocked post ;).
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no subject
Date: 2011-11-29 02:21 am (UTC)In defence of Buffy/Angel: I mean, I don't think that ship is only good for nostalgic appeal? They do have one of the best narratives in all of Jossverse. And season two is probably one of the best deconstructions of romantic tropes I've seen in fiction. I have a huge academic interest in the pairing, though I don't necessarily ship them.
no subject
Date: 2011-11-29 07:28 pm (UTC)I'm also not so much a fan of the Damon-Spike comparison. I LOVED Spike like crazy - like, serious fangirl obsession of my teenage years. But Damon would be furious if he knew he was being compared to Spike. Spike becomes something of a lapdog for a while, and it worked then, but I thought the absolute best thing about Disturbing Behavior was Damon saying he was not going to do that. He was going to be terrible because he liked being terrible, and that was that. NEVER CHANGE, MY HORRIBLE SALVATORE. ♥
no subject
Date: 2011-11-29 08:57 pm (UTC)I guess the main difference is that Buffyverse is an epic story about heroes who save the world a lot, while TVD is about a bunch of kids who keep finding themselves in the wrong place at the wrong time, constantly stepping into things bigger that themselves. Buffy is the chosen one and she has the mission. Elena wants all this crap to be over, so that she can resume her normal life. Those two stories require different rhetorics, and different rhetorics require different characters. So Damon and Spike are a little bit similar (fool for love, an ultimate performer), but you are right, Spike would never act out the way Damon acted out in Disturbing Behavior. He would never close Katherine/Drusilla in the tomb in Masquarade. He would never feed Elena/Buffy his blood, because, hell, vampirism in Buffyverse is so different from vampirism in TVD! No one ever expected Buffy to turn into a vampire, while with Elena it's a valid question. The list of differences can go ad infinitum. There are some very basic similarities that work on a very general level, but once you get into it? You get two different shows that just belong to the same genre.
no subject
Date: 2011-11-30 09:27 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-11-30 03:57 am (UTC)I LOVE BOTH DAMON AND SPIKE TOO. Favourites. But total word that Damon would take ~offence, lol. The key distinction between the two is that Damon does not sign up to the "bad boy will be saved by the love of a good woman" shtick at all (whereas it took 6 seasons for Spike to snap out of that type of thinking).
no subject
Date: 2011-11-30 07:52 am (UTC)Tell me about it :(. The trouble is that there are Damon fans who actually are rape apologists, and there are people who enjoy they high moral ground so much they refuse to notice that there are other Damon fans too... Huh, I'm being bitter, aren't I?
But total word that Damon would take ~offence
Oh, come on, they both would!!! Spike is the unique snowflake, and he doesn't want to be compared to anyone, he is ONE OF THE KIND! And especially he is NOT like some nancy boy who drinks blood from blood bags and takes part in charity events! XD
no subject
Date: 2011-11-30 09:22 am (UTC)I think we are supposed to buy into it, unfortunately. As much as I think Joss Whedon is a total genius, he has these weird lapses in logic that have always driven me insane. There are just a few characters that are above any censure, and some that get punished for absolutely everything. I have a lot of pent-up Buffy aggression, and I probably shouldn't get into it...(BUT OMG THE FREAKING SPIKE WITHOUT A SOUL VS ANGEL WITHOUT A SOUL THING MAKES NO FUCKING SENSE WHAT).
Damon and Spike are both phenomenal, but in their own ways. They both were totally silly love-sick fools as humans. The only real difference between them is that Spike got to keep the girl for a century, while Damon never had her (and had to share her with his brother, which, trauma
he hates sharing Stefan). So Spike kind of believes in happily ever after with love because he sort of had that, while Damon spent a century getting super bitter and jaded because he was miserable and alone. My poor boy. (But I'm glad for it, because I love him in all his fucked up glory).Side note: do you ever find yourself thinking, hey, Damon and Stefan are older than Spike. Weird. THIS IS HOW MY MIND WORKS NOW.
no subject
Date: 2011-11-30 10:05 am (UTC)Oh, by all means, get into it. My guess would be that many people here share your rage!
Also, WORD to your Spike vs Damon comparison. This is the reason why I can imagine functional post-Chosen Spike/Buffy, but I can't imagine functional Damon/Elena at all. Spike's been in a relationship for a century. He knows how to be with someone, he knows how relationships work in everyday life, he's always been a part of some team. While Damon? He's spent 145 years fantasizing about having a relationship. How the hell is he going to make anything work?
Side note: do you ever find yourself thinking, hey, Damon and Stefan are older than Spike.
One of the Fics I've Never Written: human Damon has his Grand Tour right before the war starts, and he meets human Drusilla in London. Because the two of them? They are more or less the same age :)
no subject
Date: 2011-11-30 03:20 pm (UTC)he hates sharing Stefan
*nod*
Totally agreed about Spike actually having experience with relationships (lol). It's interesting to me that Damon had every opportunity to build something real (e.g. Bree), but he consistently chose the path that would bring the most misery and isolation upon himself (i.e. holding on to the dream of Katherine). Damon is indentured in his self-destructiveness in a way Spike never really was.
Side note: do you ever find yourself thinking, hey, Damon and Stefan are older than Spike.
DUDE, YES, I THINK THIS EVERY DAY. Weird, right?
no subject
Date: 2011-12-01 03:13 am (UTC)I actually think about Damon and Bree a fair amount. I do find it intriguing that Damon built his whole self-image on the fact that no one ever chooses him, that it's always Stefan, but Bree DID choose him. And I wonder how many other girls fell for Damon like that. He just never even considered it. My self-destructive boy, he just seeks out misery and loneliness.
DUDE, YES, I THINK THIS EVERY DAY. Weird, right?
BUT SERIOUSLY, right? I just sort of assume that since Spike existed in my mind so many years before the Salvatores, he just has to be older, but he's not, and it kind of boggles my mind. Like, who would win in a fight to the death? Though they would never fight to the death. They would probably get along way too well.
no subject
Date: 2011-12-01 04:42 am (UTC)I do find it intriguing that Damon built his whole self-image on the fact that no one ever chooses him, that it's always Stefan, but Bree DID choose him. And I wonder how many other girls fell for Damon like that. He just never even considered it.
I think Damon did consider it, somewhere in the back of his mind. And he REJECTED it. His entire identity hinges on being Alone. If he is not Alone, then he is nothing. So he must preserve his own isolation; his whole Self depends on it.
Though they would never fight to the death. They would probably get along way too well.
Haha, I think I decided with
no subject
Date: 2011-12-01 08:41 am (UTC)His entire identity hinges on being Alone. If he is not Alone, then he is nothing.
My glorious psychopath. He needs so much therapy. Part of why I'm eager for D/E to finally get together (other than the ridiculous sex they're obviously going to have) is that I'm so fascinated by what Damon will do when he IS chosen by one of the girls he's deemed 'unobtainable.' I feel like his self-destructive mind will implode and he will freak out about something, and it will be so horribly compelling to watch him destroy his own chance of happiness, because he quite literally does not know how to be happy.
There would be a leather jacket bitch-off.
I DID NOT THINK OF THIS. Valid. There would be a lot of comments about Spike's being longer (insert innuendo here). But I remain convinced that they would probably bitch at each other up until either Angel or Stefan showed up, and then suddenly they'd be such solidarity sisters. They'd just look at each other and go, "Bro, I know, right? Bro." And then they'd be fast friends.
no subject
Date: 2011-12-01 11:52 am (UTC)I APPROVE OF THIS PLAN. And take all the time you need with your Buffy Rage. MINE IS HERE TO STAY LOL.
Part of why I'm eager for D/E to finally get together (other than the ridiculous sex they're obviously going to have) is that I'm so fascinated by what Damon will do when he IS chosen by one of the girls he's deemed 'unobtainable.'
Uh huh. Yeah. Though, I really doubt that Elena will ever ~choose~ Damon. She'll probably fall in in love with him proper, but there will be plausible deniability the entire way through. People will argue over the legitimacy of their feelings for years to come. THIS IS NOT MY FIRST RODEO, OKAY.
Also, Damon's habit of destroying his own chances at happiness is exactly the reason I kind of DON'T want Elena to ~commit~ to him? I think they should be a trainwreck, don't get me wrong, but not the kind of trainwreck that just gives more fodder for the good!Stefan/bad!Damon people (lol). One of the things I appreciate about the D/E deconstruction is that Damon's worst acts towards Elena have been done before she's totally returned his feelings, ergo she is not falling blindly. (It's the anti-Elena/Stefan, obviously.) ERGO, Damon surely can't do anything worse than the Jeremy neck-snapping or Elena force-feeding after this point. If there's gonna be dysfunction (which there surely will), it's gonna be from both sides. I am counting on Elena becoming more and more selfish re: Damon's love for her, and more manipulative. IT WILL BE GLORIOUS. (oh my god why do i ship this way)
But I remain convinced that they would probably bitch at each other up until either Angel or Stefan showed up, and then suddenly they'd be such solidarity sisters. They'd just look at each other and go, "Bro, I know, right? Bro."
Ahhhh, you make a compelling argument.
no subject
Date: 2011-12-01 11:58 am (UTC)Come on, it would all go like:
"This is my brother. He is a ~good vampire."
"Tell me about it. Here comes Captain Forehead. He is NOT my brother. Not EVER."
"Captain Forehead?"
"Extensive forehead brooding."
"Tell me about it..."
Also: I TOTALLY APPROVE OF YOUR WAY OF D/E SHIPPING!
no subject
Date: 2011-12-01 06:11 pm (UTC)And trust me, I am in NO hurry to repeat the Logan/Veronica disaster (e.g. he screws up all the time so she can flounce off in righteous indignation and declare that he never was good enough for her in the first place - another show I have TONS OF PENT UP RAGE FOR.). I want Elena and Damon to be equally complicit in their dysfunction. I'm just waiting for Elena to finally snap, and I would LOVE to see her admit her selfishness about Damon. It's already there - she expects so much of him, and she clearly manipulates him, which they're both well aware of. The more Katherine Elena gets, the more awesome everything will be. Basically, I want all the characters to have identity crises, because I'm sadistic like that.
One of the things I appreciate about the D/E deconstruction is that Damon's worst acts towards Elena have been done before she's totally returned his feelings, ergo she is not falling blindly.
In a weird way, this is what I find most functional about them? Like, people rant about how Elena could possible love Damon after what he's done to her, but seriously, if she could love him after that (which she clearly kind of already does), their relationship actually sort of might work? He actually can't do anything worse to her, like, really. And if they can get through that, they can get through anything. It's why I'm D/E instead of S/E. She's not blind to his darkness - for a while, that's ALL she saw. If she still likes him after that, well, these kids can make it work (in a messed up, not at all logical way).
/shipping rant (YOU KNOW THIS IS A HOT TOPIC FOR ME.)
no subject
Date: 2011-12-01 06:21 pm (UTC)I think Damon would totally freak out if Elena suddenly decided she wanted him. That's why he's behaving like a freaking twelve-year-old; his mindset is based on an assumption that he can never have her, so he can as well be a troll, at least he'd have some fun.
no subject
Date: 2011-12-01 07:14 pm (UTC)I am seriously into Damon having a total freak out once Elena finally admits she wants him. I can see him having a panic attack and running away, and Elena just standing there with this WTF face going "seriously? After all this time...SERIOUSLY?" It'll be awesome.
no subject
Date: 2011-12-01 07:25 pm (UTC)But I don't think he would run away. He would have a panic attack from hell, but he would stay and let everything happen, because he is physically incapable of quitting. He would stay even if he was sure that it would lead to a complete disaster. Our boy is pathetic like that.
no subject
Date: 2011-12-01 09:00 pm (UTC)WRITE THE FIC. I have an insane fear of writing D/E (too close to my heart, I guess, and I live in fear of not being able to articulate my version of their feelings), but I live in hope that someday my ridiculous scenario will happen. Can't you just see Nina's adorable face looking SO bewildered? My bbs. <333
no subject
Date: 2011-12-02 07:45 am (UTC)One thing that makes me laugh in fandom is how everybody assumes that Damon will be all over Elena now that Stefan's gone. No. Damon is quite happy to flirt outrageously with Elena, and ~show her the way to a vampire's heart, only because there is no real chance of him getting what he wants. As brave as Damon is, he is also a coward. I mean. He's only willing to tell Elena that he loves her when a) he can make her forget afterwards, or b) HE CAN DIE AFTERWARDS LOL. The fact that Elena does not love him back means that he is safe.
Oh, and ITA with your thoughts re: Elena's selfishness and the lack of idealism in D/E. It's why I ship them, too. It's the trial by fire. I do prefer that construction generally. I feel like S/E (in S1-2) have such a normative model of a relationship, which is fine, but it falls apart outside that framework. We don't know what they are independent of that normative structure. (Or, we haven't found out yet.) D/E is interesting to me in that--from what I can tell--it seems to be the opposite. I truly think that trying to carry out a conventional relationship (complete with labelling and defining and whatnot) would kill them both, lol. Sort of like Barney and Robin. (Not that they are the same.)
no subject
Date: 2011-12-02 07:54 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-12-02 08:20 am (UTC)(no subject)
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Date: 2011-12-02 09:40 am (UTC)(no subject)
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Date: 2011-12-02 09:50 am (UTC)One thing that makes me laugh in fandom is how everybody assumes that Damon will be all over Elena now that Stefan's gone.
Ugh, that makes me CRAZY. What were these people expecting? The obnoxious blind D/E shippers were all excited that Damon could finally move in, but that's sort of a total bro-code violation (thank you, Barney Stintson), and it's trite and predictable and just boring. I love the fact that the impediments to D/E have nothing to do with Stefan, at least not insofar as he's Elena's boyfriend. That was never Damon's problem. Their issues are all their own, and I am so with you that Damon could not handle the thought that Elena might actually go for him - that he's actually a coward in this matter. Also, LOL at point B. Imminent death is such a handy excuse (until the death stops being imminent, and then it's just awkward).
I'm actually really curious about Barney and Robin! Because you're right, they are similarly allergic to normal relationships, but how is the show going to reconcile their massive complexes without the convenient excuse of 'hey vampires! moral codes don't apply quite the same way huzzah!' *pondering*
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From:light format is the way to go, bro
From:Re: light format is the way to go, bro
From:Re: light format is the way to go, bro
From:Re: light format is the way to go, bro
From:Re: light format is the way to go, bro
From:Re: light format is the way to go, bro
From:Re: light format is the way to go, bro
From:Re: light format is the way to go, bro
From:no subject
Date: 2011-11-29 09:06 pm (UTC)I shall pay attention the next time I watch it :).